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  1. #61
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    Can’t dispute the tide level topic but still can’t accept that relocating sand and ocean bottom material is good for the ecosystem.
    As said above I never remember the dredging as a kid through the sixties.
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  3. #62
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    Prior to 1963 following the March 1962 storm the ONLY dredging in South Jersey that took place was inlet mouths and intercaostal waterways.. Inlets like Corsons and Hereford were kept open and inshore waterways were deep,fishing was outstanding .Once Beach replenishment started in 1963 our inshore channels began getting shoaled with sand as well as our wetlands getting destroyed by sand . Numerous sod mussel beds destroyed . ICW in NJ no longer has the required depth in many spots in NJ. ALL of this started with beach replenishment and our experts thinking they were smarter than Mother Nature
    We have met the enemy and he/she is an educated expert with no common sense thinking they are smarter than mother nature
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    BUCKTAIL WILLIE<br /> fishologist and master tagger A FISH IS TOO VALUABLE TO CATCH JUST ONCE MEMBER RFA,,ALS,NAFC, IGFA,,Stripers Forever ,SFEC ,Tri-State Ang. recipent of Sagamore of the Wabash (IN)
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  4. #63
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    yea dig up all the little lumps, grass beds,,clam beds,,offshore,,, then pump the sand on the beach and smother the sand fleas.,,little crabs...baby clams,,,The other thing is the beach raking to cleaning up peoples trash,, also not to good for the beach environment ....when I was a kid I grew up on the beach,,,loads of life on the sand back then,,,everything from big ghost crabs to small fish and shellfish all over the place,,,,now its just a big clean sand box

    JoeR.
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  6. #64
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    Raking the beaches is a hole other thread.$$$$$$$
    " The longer they're on, the bigger that hole is getting." The Legend

  7. #65
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    Barnaby, Your Undergraduate understanding of the tides and the physics of water flow is reminiscent of the days of the geocentric mindset.
    In a static environment (all other forces except gravity are in equilibrium) your theories are applicable. In the lab, you know your ****! Congrats.
    Oscillations of wave energy (not surf waves, energy waves) result in flooding. This is a result of inlet(s) shape, size, and depth as compared to the flooded areas physical volume. Not to mention the effects from even the slightest amount of wind.

    I have skipped over many specifics, as your not worth my time. bottom line is, You have an understanding of 80% of the controlling factors... Congrats on the C-... at least you passed.

  8. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by shellman View Post
    Barnaby, Your Undergraduate understanding of the tides and the physics of water flow is reminiscent of the days of the geocentric mindset.
    In a static environment (all other forces except gravity are in equilibrium) your theories are applicable. In the lab, you know your ****! Congrats.
    Oscillations of wave energy (not surf waves, energy waves) result in flooding. This is a result of inlet(s) shape, size, and depth as compared to the flooded areas physical volume. Not to mention the effects from even the slightest amount of wind.

    I have skipped over many specifics, as your not worth my time. bottom line is, You have an understanding of 80% of the controlling factors... Congrats on the C-... at least you passed.
    Shellman, by my own admission I am not knowledgeable like you are in the science. I have only watched the gradual destruction of our Inlet and Fishery, especially over the last 30 years. I have watched the mussel beds, eel grass, and turtle grass flats get burred under 1-3 feet of sand, never to return.

    Therefore, I appreciate your insights. Are you at all familiar with Stone Harbor/Hereford Inlet? If you are, I would appreciate your conclusions based on your knowledge and observations. Thanks
    Last edited by fish643; 03-20-2017 at 09:30 AM.

  9. #67
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    in case anyone didn't know, matthew barnaby was a wiseass punk hockey player. so, the name is fitting.

    111th st in Stone Harbor on Saturday...looks like the storm didn't take much sand back.

    [IMG][/IMG]

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    Last edited by Ryan D.; 03-20-2017 at 09:57 AM.
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  10. #68
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    Ryan, it looks like a desert instead of a healthy beach
    BUCKTAIL WILLIE<br /> fishologist and master tagger A FISH IS TOO VALUABLE TO CATCH JUST ONCE MEMBER RFA,,ALS,NAFC, IGFA,,Stripers Forever ,SFEC ,Tri-State Ang. recipent of Sagamore of the Wabash (IN)
    a skillful angler must be full of humble thoughts NEW MEMBER of Ancient Mariners
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  11. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by shellman View Post
    Barnaby, Your Undergraduate understanding of the tides and the physics of water flow is reminiscent of the days of the geocentric mindset.
    In a static environment (all other forces except gravity are in equilibrium) your theories are applicable. In the lab, you know your ****! Congrats.
    Oscillations of wave energy (not surf waves, energy waves) result in flooding. This is a result of inlet(s) shape, size, and depth as compared to the flooded areas physical volume. Not to mention the effects from even the slightest amount of wind.

    I have skipped over many specifics, as your not worth my time. bottom line is, You have an understanding of 80% of the controlling factors... Congrats on the C-... at least you passed.
    Thanks for your graduate input, Bill Nye.

    Hopefully, we'll run into each other at one of the coastal towns I work in daily, and you can enlighten me with all your knowledge.
    outlaw and NotAtWork like this.
    Bern
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  12. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by BUCKTAIL WILLIE View Post
    Prior to 1963 following the March 1962 storm the ONLY dredging in South Jersey that took place was inlet mouths and intercaostal waterways.. Inlets like Corsons and Hereford were kept open and inshore waterways were deep,fishing was outstanding .Once Beach replenishment started in 1963 our inshore channels began getting shoaled with sand as well as our wetlands getting destroyed by sand . Numerous sod mussel beds destroyed . ICW in NJ no longer has the required depth in many spots in NJ. ALL of this started with beach replenishment and our experts thinking they were smarter than Mother Nature
    We have met the enemy and he/she is an educated expert with no common sense thinking they are smarter than mother nature
    No one that is a proponent of beachfills thinks they are smarter then Mother Nature.
    It is maintenance, not a permanent repair. They are scheduled for every few years.

    Beachfills do 2 things:
    1) Make a place for visitors to go. Tourism brings in billions to NJ, and they are not coming here to visit the interior of the state, they are coming for the beaches.
    2) Beachfills allow for the erosion of the coastal areas to take place 600 feet from dunes and homes. Again, no beachfront/beach block homes, no tourists and the NJ economy takes a huge hit.

    As far as the backbays, there is dredging of waterways going on right now in SH and Avalon. The educated expert is aware that the backbays need to be dredged.
    Bern
    Millville, NJ

  13. #71
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    Ryan D - look a page 3 for another prespective from the high tide line of the "new" beachfill.
    Fishing the Beaches, Inlets and Bays of Cape May Co.
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  14. #72
    CJB
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    Ryan, the beach lost 36"-40". Take a look at the pictures on page 3. They more than likely ran a dozer over the beach to flatten it out.

  15. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by shellman View Post
    , You have an understanding of 80% of the controlling factors... Congrats on the C-... at least you passed.
    An 80% is a gentleman's B-, thank you very much.
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  16. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by barnaby View Post
    No one that is a proponent of beachfills thinks they are smarter then Mother Nature.
    It is maintenance, not a permanent repair. They are scheduled for every few years.

    Beachfills do 2 things:
    1) Make a place for visitors to go. Tourism brings in billions to NJ, and they are not coming here to visit the interior of the state, they are coming for the beaches.
    2) Beachfills allow for the erosion of the coastal areas to take place 600 feet from dunes and homes. Again, no beachfront/beach block homes, no tourists and the NJ economy takes a huge hit.

    As far as the backbays, there is dredging of waterways going on right now in SH and Avalon. The educated expert is aware that the backbays need to be dredged.
    You forgot the third thing, destroys the nature habitats of our offshore lumps and beaches

  17. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by barnaby View Post
    Money well spent
    Beach tourism brings in billions of dollars to NJ
    And if the beachfills weren't done and the damage was to homes and streets etc, that would be a huge insurance cost.
    You killed all your other hypothesis with these statements everyone already knew it only took you longer to admit it! It's all about the money, period. When isn't it scientist? Add the Army Corp to the equation and it becomes about spending more money than it should cost to do too.
    John pa, Scaleddown and NotAtWork like this.

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