Brigantine votes a resounding NO

[njfisher]

Due to the enormous pressure from condominium owners who live in Brigantine, compared to the amount of fisherman who were for it, the Brigantine council voted down the recommendation to open a fishing only beach north of brant drive.

Two councilmen voted for it, Cong. Bob Solari and Cong. Sue schilling.

Five councilmen voyed against it.

Thank you Bob Solari and Sue Schilling.

[candyman]

Unfortunately, it seems Brigantine is a victim of it's own success. Way back when in the eighties nobody cared. Now that Brigantine is in the hot shore real estate market and "your Island for life" , the politcos are going to pay attention to the voters. The voters who weren't there 20 years ago. If ya think ya got it bad just look at Ocean City. They have like 200 buggy passes and somebody gotta die for anyone to get one. But then again.....look at their property value too ;)

[rustyhook]

Extremely poor showing of fishermen from Brigantine. For all the effort put into this effort by Phil 4, njfishermen, and surf ghost you would of thought that fishermen would of packed the building. We were out numbered two to one and the condo assoc. only has 100 family units.
.
Most of the fishermen who were present were from out of town which in this case carried no weight as far as council was concerned.

It all boiled down to who would or would not be elected at the next election and the numbers game was diffenitly against the fishermen in the hall wednesday.
You could only sit and watch as the council members were slowly but surely swayed to defeat the measure.

[NIGHTSTRIKES]

Brigantine rejects four-wheel-drive access plan
By JOHN BRAND Staff Writer, (609) 272-7275

BRIGANTINE - On any given summer day fisherman Ken Krebs might bring with him two to four surf-fishing rods, a cooler for his fish, two tackle boxes, fishing waders to protect his clothing, and 4- to 5-feet-tall sand spikes to help hold his line.

And that doesn't include what his two children - ages 10 and 7 - bring along when they join him.

"When you have a lot of gear with you and some kids, carrying that stuff just isn't practical," he said.

Krebs is one of more than 3,500 people who purchase four-wheel drive permits for beach access annually, contributing nearly $400,000 to the city budget.

On the other hand, Nancy Donahue will fill a little red wagon full of the toys her two grandchildren want to take to the beach and then they trek their way to a desirable beach spot.

"Why can't fishermen carry their fishing poles?" she said.

It looks like they might have to.

City Council passed a "voice resolution" at its public meeting Wednesday night that essentially shot down a proposal to allow four-wheel drive access at Brant Avenue.

The resolution will be formally put in writing at the city's Feb. 18 meeting, Mayor Philip J. Guenther said.

City Council created a beach committee in November after a surfer was hooked by a wayward fishing line this summer at the city's popular South End jetty -- a 350-yard swath where hundreds of fishermen, bathers and surfers, many driving SUVs - congregate on any summer day

The committee asked the city to open Brant Avenue, which currently connects to the beach via a small walkway, to four-wheel drive vehicles.

The beach off Brant Avenue and three blocks north would be designated for fishermen and bathers only, therefore, alleviating the density at the jetty, the proposal said.

But a large number of city residents, including many from Cloisters Condominiums, located near the proposed access road, spoke against the proposal.

Many claimed opening the road would drive down property values, create more safety problems, destroy plant and animal ecosystems and ruin their quality of life.

Yet fishermen are beginning to feel unwanted.

Although for most of the year they can drive along and fish off the entire stretch of the city's eight-and-a-half miles of beachfront, they only have two locations where they can drive and park their vehicles in the summer.

One is at the South End jetty, which could cause more safety concerns, and the other is at the state park at the city's northernmost tip.

But, the state's Department of Environmental Protection closes a large portion of the northern beaches to four-wheel drive vehicles each summer because of nesting piping plovers, a federally recognized endangered bird species.

Despite fishermen's concerns, Mayor Guenther thinks the city devotes enough space for fishermen during the summer and in the off-season.

Guenther said that more than five miles of the city's beaches are open to fishermen each summer, but he admitted that most of them couldn't be accessed by SUVs.

"Do we have access to fishing in Brigantine? The answer is yes. We have plenty of room," he said.

"If we try - and this has been the American trend - to so-called super-size our four-wheel drive areas, we may put in jeopardy what we presently have and I'm very concerned with that."

The council voted 5-2 to keep Brant Avenue as it is. Council members Bob Solari and Sue Schilling cast the dissenting votes.

[fishtrek]

Well than since I don't live there We need to ask if our beach permits will allow us to park in the street in that section of town without being ticketed!!!

[fishtrek]

Well than since I don't live there We need to ask if our beach permits will allow us to park in the street in that section of town without being ticketed!!!

[fshrwmn]

Maybe I am missing something here. As fishermen (women) Are you guys saying that you have given up trying to keep the 352 yards of beach that we have had since I can remeber. from the jetty up to the pileings? You were in favor of allowing Brigantine to just MOVE us up the beach so the surfers can take over that nice little fishing spot next to the jetty?
I just don't get it....
Part of tournament fishing that can be frustrating to me is haveing to stay in a "picked" area between two markers on the beach and not being allowed to move from that spot. But that's tournaments....six hours on a Saturday spring and fall.
Let me see Brant drive....markers there on my left....markers down there on my right...don't cross the line or you could be disquailified, or in the case of Brigantine lose your $200 pass.
seems like they want to keep the jetty for the surfers and they are gonna throw the fishermen a bone. "here's your postion" and you guys are saying Thank you.
Tell me what am I missing here? :(
fshrwmn

[njfisher]

Fisherwoman,

You got it wrong. There was nothing in the proposal about stopping us from fishin the jetty.

This proposal was just to get us a EXTRA beach to fish from in the SUMMER during lifeguard hours, where we would not have to worry about hooking into the surfer and jet skiers.

There was nothing in the proposal about stopping us form fishing where we already have access.

[fshrwmn]

The Brigantine Times Feb 6
" with the fisherman agreeing to not fish off the sand at the jetty during the hours the lifegaurds are on duty."

Why is it safer to have people in the water, requiring life guards, next to the jetty than to have fisherman standing on the beach fishing?

the logic here eludes me.....

I think the beach at Brant was throwing us a bone so that the surfers can have the jetty.
Brant drive Beach "ALSO" would have been great.
I don't think thats what was happening here.

[SURF GHOST]

Just a REALLY Bad showing of Fisherman !!!!! Rusty hook, Put out a good arguement, but he is a resident !!!! I don't see what being a resident has to do with the beach ????? :confused: I Buy the Permit !!! I should have a say in the matter !!!! These People think they own the Beach !!! What's with that ??? That's like saying if you weren't born in America you have no say !!! I Think a Discrimination lawsuit should be in order against Choquill Beach Resident ----& CITY COUNCIL !!! The saying "You don't live here you don't have NO SAY " ---- That's DISCRIMINATION !!! Down & Out !!!.. Hope that Snake & Snake take them to the Bank !!!!.... redface.gif -- SG

[finaddict5]

Surf Ghost- I sympathize with what you are saying. I wish things were better for us fisherman who enjoy Brigatine but are not residents. Unfortunately if you are not a constituent, they really don't care. Costituents=VOTES!!!!! And the politicians WILL Always take care of their constituents. Their who keep them in power.

[ 02-06-2004, 03:56 PM: Message edited by: finaddict5 ]

[SURF GHOST]

Finatic5, I Understand what your saying !!! But at a Council Meeting that's being recorded !!! I think this is a Definate Predjudcial act or Comment !!!.... It's on record !! Why should I be forced not to Voice My Opinion When they take my Money ????----- Should I lay down & Die ???? HELL NO !!!! ---- :D :D __ SG

IS THIS AMERICA ?????--- We Should have a say if they take our MONEY !!! :eek: tongue.gif :mad: :mad:

Sorry for the spelling !!! -- :D

[ 02-11-2004, 08:23 AM: Message edited by: SURF GHOST ]

[njfisher]

Ghost

Let it go.

[BEACHBASSARD]

GOOD THINKING WALT!!

[FISH BUCKET]

perhaps the problem wasn't the beach,but cutting a road to access the beach.there is an access road north of brant road.could we use that and go south to the same beach?i don't think we should give up on that spot yet.all we have to sway are two councilmen.
do you think the vote would have been different,if 1000 fishermen showed up?or was it decided in advance?

[candyman]

IS THIS AMERICA ?????--- We Should have a say if they take our MONEY !!!


it's all about registered Voters, Ghost. Those people on the beach block who spent millions are ignored if they are registered out of town. That's why there was legislation for the summer people to be able to vote in local elections. Don't know what happened to bill, but I was all for it. It would make another group of people that they would have to answer to.

It's small town politics. I'm going through the same thing here...Hell, I could run and WIN.......but then no time to fish and nobody would ever believe a word I say again ;)

In my circumstance, my shop is in a Redevelopment zone and is targeted for eminent domian takeover. They want to give my land to developer. My mayor's name is Tim Kreisher...I had 1000 bumper stickers made up that say "TIMMY GOTTA GO" and have been handing them out. (We have an election coming up)

We still live in America, Ghost....cause if this were China they woulda shot my ass long ago.

[ 02-08-2004, 08:39 AM: Message edited by: candyman ]

[candyman]

:rolleyes:

[ 02-08-2004, 08:35 AM: Message edited by: candyman ]

[K2]

I'd still like to see us get at least the first 150 yards north of the south jetty, exclusively. Set out buoy markers in the water (like they do for the lifeguard boats in front of the hotel)150 yards north of the jetty, and a piling on the beach to show a divider between surfing and fishing.

As for whether you live here or not, that shouldn't make a difference in this case. A great majority of those Cloister owners are not year round residents. They don't make Brig there primary residence. They showed up in numbers and got what they wanted. Also, for having voter rights, I'm not in favor of that at all. If they want vote, make this your primary residence. I just don't want people who come down here part time, voting down budgets...school etc... because they don't use the services year round.

For instance - if they don't like the fact that Brigantine allows fishing buggys on the beach, like we have had for DECADES, then go find a beach community that doesn't permit them. Do your homework before you invest.

These Cloister people,IMO, and others like them, new second home owners, would jump at the chance to vote and ban buggys on the entire beach.== Watch out for my grandschildren! Oh, the environment!==. With a huge population of baby boomers liquidating portfolios for real eastate and the coveted shore home, their numbers are going to dramatically increase and so is their idea of how they want their new community to look. I kinda like Brigantine the way it is, not the way its going.

[fshrwmn]

K2,
thats what I am saying...have we given up on trying to keep part of that jetty area?
good fishing, natural bait trap...and we already have a access road that takes us there.
I am all in favor of adding more to our alloted area but does that mean we have to lose prime space to get it? Like I said in the meeting we already give up the inlet side during the summer because we get pushed out. Should we allow the surfers to also push us out of the jetty area too? I am not ready to give up quite that easily just because the city is throwng us a bone. One I might add that the "Voters" don't want to give us.

[SURF GHOST]

No Bones bieng thrown here !!!! ----- More like a Snake Bite !!! .... --- :( -- SG

[ 02-09-2004, 05:23 AM: Message edited by: SURF GHOST ]

[K2]

fshrwmn - I agree. I don't think we should abandon the south jetty option just yet. I have my doubts, after listening to Guenther at the meeting that night, that anything between 14th street north and south approx. Seaside rd would be open to buggy access on lifeguard duty hours during the summer.

On the other hand, I've noticed a huge increase in the crowds over the past couple years on the south end - jetty and cove. I'm afaid they're only gonna get more and more crowded (mainly from mid June to Labor day) leaving the city with the mind frame that we fishermen/women will have to make due with what they throw us. I sense they believe we have adequate space the remaining months....fall derby, striper tourneys etc..

We'll have to organize better, come to a consensus on another proposal, be effectively persuasive and most of all - show our numbers.

[K2]

Ah-Ha!!!

AC Press Editorial for Monday Feb 9th

DRIVING ON BRIGANTINE?S BEACH
A line in the sand
Brigantine Mayor Philip J. Guenther said he was worried that the trend to super-size everything could threaten the character of his town's beaches. He was concerned about the more-is-always-better philosophy when applied to allowing people to bring their four-wheel-drive vehicles onto the beach.

And so Guenther and City Council rejected a proposal last week that would have opened the beach at Brant Avenue and three blocks north to those vehicles.

It was a good decision, one that recognizes there can be too much of a good thing. Fishermen driving onto the beach to cast their lines into the surf are a traditional part of life in this beach town. But Brigantine officials have simply chosen where to draw the line in their sand.

Part of the problem is that several years ago Brigantine dropped its policy of selling only a limited number of permits for beach access by SUVs and similar vehicles. The move has generated a lot of revenue for the city from the several thousand $150 permits sold each year, but it has created summer traffic jams in the areas of the beach where the vehicles are permitted, mainly a 350-yard section at the South End jetty.

That crush spurred a newly created beach committee to recommend opening the Brant Avenue area to four-wheel-drives. But many residents objected to the proposal, saying it would create safety issues, destroy ecosystems and ruin their quality of life, including their property values.

The mayor and council took both sides into account and decided that there already is enough beach access for surf fishermen. Guenther pointed out that more than five miles of beach are open to fishermen during the summer, although not all of it is accessible by vehicle.

This specific issue will be decided when a resolution rejecting the Brant Avenue proposal is formally approved at the city's Feb. 18 meeting, but the problem of fishermen feeling squeezed is likely to arise again. A more permanent solution might be for the city to think again about limiting the number of four-wheel-drive permits it sells each year.

[fshrwmn]

Very well said K2,
write it up...throw it in a post for some feed back and lets get it in.
and hey!
who would know better about bones than a Ghost!! ;)

[SURF GHOST]

" I Heard That " !!!!! ---- LOL !!!!.... ;) :D -- SG

[fshrwmn]

glad to see your starting to get some of your humor back.......I was getting worried there alittle :D

[SURF GHOST]

Originally posted by fshrwmn:
glad to see your starting to get some of your humor back.......I was getting worried there alittle :D ;) :D -- SG