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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Just did some math. last year fuel was about $3.10 on average a little more at certain points. Oil was runing about $60-$65 a barrrel, Now oil is $108. In some ways I am gladd I sold my Viking Last year. At about 65 gallons per hour how can you justify any canyon trip unles there is a serious bite. How many friends do you have can afford to pitch in $$$ on costs EVRY WEEK when they are under stress form all the increases of fuel and commodoties in their normal life. I just read thread about when does it make sense and I bilieve that money has much less to do with it and its more about common sense and % to income. Think about it with a hypothetical income of $1 miliion per year after taxes with a very good account and depreciation scedules/ your still paying in the 30% tax bracket. net $700,000.00 So does it makes sense to spend nearly 20% of evry dollar you earn on fishing with absoulty no finacial return on your investmant (boat) actually its worth less each year? Again, 20 cents of every earned dollar.

Will $6 diesel hurt offshore charters ? As a matter of math for the cost of owning a large boat you could charter a boat for all 16 fishable Saturdays and fish offshore with no headace. Then take 3 winter trips to faroff destinations where ther is serious billfishing and still have change left over. Maybe theres a new market for charter boat clientele.

Funny thing is I treid to buy a few 30 -35ft custom express boats to try and split the middle but found that the ones that were close to being priced right in this market were upside down in their boats and had to write a check to sell their boar for what the actual cash value is at this point, So what you think, would be a good buying opportunity in some cases is not. When everyone is fat with cash they takes less becuase they want a new one and just want to move on. But when earning is tuff they just want to move down and don't like to part with money.

I guess I would have to ask how many peolple on thsi site think that spending 20% of their income for fishing makes any sense at all no matter what the actuall DOLLARS involved are. And can you REALLY justify it? considering the potentail increase in fuel, bait,maintence, parts etc. You suggetions on moving down further (From an 35'express to a 30'outboard) than anticpaited would be apreciated. How many went from a new mid size convertible to an outboard boat. Can u really pull a dredge for whites? How many overnighters do you do and do you bring a generator? WHAT IS A % of income towards FISHING that MAKES SENSE whether you own a boat or not?

Just my 2 cents and looking for your 2 cents after being absent from the barn for a while.

Missed you guys

Captn
Val
Warden Pass
 

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I run a 30 cc and do overnight trips with with 4 other anglers. this brings the cost down some but you really have to pick your days to go offshore. I do have a gen that i bring and bean bags, that make it pretty comfortable. also have friends with same size boat and they do pretty good offshore, as far as the money, your right about owning and putting out big bucks vs just doing chartering all season. I fish for just about everything from flounder to strippers, drum and a lot of wreck fishing along with my offshore stuff so the 30 cc is just about perfect. BUT ITS STILL A LOT OF CASH OUTLAY:eek: you just got to love it
 

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Val even in a good economy when can you ever justify the amount it costs to fish offshore.:eek: :eek: I don't care how much people make it never makes sense. We do it for the love of fishing and if we ever stopped and did the math we should all throw up. :rolleyes: What I can't figure out is the you can build a 6000 sq ft custom house with every imaginable immentity for less money that you can buy a 50' or greater boat. :confused: :confused: There is no justification for a large boat to cost 1,2 or 3 million dollars.:confused: :confused: No matter how you look at it; the sport and love of fishing is a big waste of money. Yet i will continue to waste money I guess.;) I'm ready to spend money and run off to that warm water if the weather would cooperate.
 

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If Your Serious About Offshore Fishing, To Me The Right Way Is Not Buy The 2 To 3 Million Dollar Boat But To Build A Boat Like The Bad Bouy --the Outta Bounds (it Will Be A Different Name I Think) Or The Down Deep . Big Enough To Take The Pounding And Not As Expensive To Use.

Catt.val--how Do You Think You Will Handle Being Boatless Or Are You Still Looking For Something Smaller To Fill The Void??
 

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Cost Efficiency of Offshore Fishing

Warden: I think you have correct idea. You have to find a good quality, older midrange hull i.e. 31-35' that hs been repowered with newer diesels and maintained by prior owners. That way you don't sink a small fortune upfront into cost of boat and it is affordable to buy and cheaper to run than a large rig. Next, it always takes awhile to get everything straightend out, reliable and fitted to your budget and type of fishing. Once you are there, you use the boat for long runs only with a group of guys who share the expense of the trip. I have a repowered 32 Hatt express and my friend has a repowered 32 black finn. We have 4 regular guys we fish with and a couple alternates. We rotate use of vessels and share all expenses. We don't run out every week. Only once or twice a month. Cost is manageable but you always spend alot in the end. You really have to enjoy the offshore trips and you just have to keep looking until you find the right boat.
 

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THese downeast hulls seem to be thebest choice. Big boats, seaworthy, and good on fuel. Average overnighter uses about 150 gallons of fuel. They are not as fast (20-25 kt.) but they get out there and you can afford to run them.
 

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alot of good points to consider. The reality is the many guys spend 20% or more on their hobbies fishing or any other hobby. That is why America is the consumer nation. We borrow, spent, never really doing the math, a main driver of our economy is to always lag behind the other countries in our ability to do math (lol). If people did half the math of the stuff they spend, they would rethink many things. Guys with boats tend to be risk takers, self employed types who like challenges. also, to finance expensive toys u need to be creative with money. People justify the expense by watching the value of other things go up up up. But when it stops going up u r forced to think differently. Boats are wealth destroyers in good times and in bad times and will always be so, the book milionaire next door had a short list of wealth building rules in the beginning, right at the top of the list of ways to get and keep money is DO NOT BUY A BOAT. But the answer to your questions of how can u justify, i think age and life curve are key factors. If u are retired and dont have fifty other moving parts moving at the same time, 20% is not bad at all. If u have kids who need college money etc.. or need to put that 20% to work in better wealth generating vechicles well thats different. If u are making over 1 million a year, i think u know what u r doing already, but the business side of you makes u look realistically at the numbers and say "this is freakin crazy" Personally i think oil has topped out and am shorting oil heavily here and will continue to short oil. Demand destruction has begun and will continue to build inventories and shut down demand. All commods are overpriced and ready to correct. Markets remain irrational for a long long time before there is a sea change, look at the stock bubble, the real estate bubble, the writing is always on the wall, it is a matter of when not if.
 

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BIGGESTJACK said:
If Your Serious About Offshore Fishing, To Me The Right Way Is Not Buy The 2 To 3 Million Dollar Boat But To Build A Boat Like The Bad Bouy --the Outta Bounds (it Will Be A Different Name I Think) Or The Down Deep . Big Enough To Take The Pounding And Not As Expensive To Use.

Catt.val--how Do You Think You Will Handle Being Boatless Or Are You Still Looking For Something Smaller To Fill The Void??
Agee 100 percent

I can tell you this ALL charters down here in Florida are really hurting.

To me the big CC's with 4 stroke gas engines make more sense now more than ever.
Less money on maintenance, no cost while at the dock( AC), and yes gas is CHEAPER than diesel now, maybe for good,
I pay 3.25-3.50 for 89 octane right now, we burn about 35-40 gallons per hour, yesterday I ran a total of 240 miles and burned about 225 gallons

Total cost for the trip 880, was 780 for gas 100 for bait and ice. 220 dollars per man. We usually do take home at least 20 pounds of fish each which easily covers the contribution

Total cost for my trip
 

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What you think is all fine & dandy…but the bottom line is not the bottom line. The boat I run has a million dollar budget per year. If it went to more then that so be it. For most of the people I have come to know that are involved in this sport, it is more of a habit then a hobby. “We don’t drink, gamble, cheat on our wives, smoke, take drugs, or play golf, we fish”! We sleep, work, walk, and talk, fishing all the time. We fish every moment that time will allow us. I think there is no “percentage of income” needed to be dedicated to fishing. If you truly love it you will always find a way to hear the sound of a screaming reel every time you “need the fix” You see for me, not only is it my livelihood, it’s my life. My wife & my children come first, then fishing. I could not think of a life without all three. Be it a $65,000.00 or a $4,200,000.00 Bertram it’s all the same when the dance begins…….. Just my 2cents ;)
 

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simple

The answer is simple, but it will not be the same for all of us. The money we spend to offshore fish has never made sense whether gas was $5/gallon, or $1/gal. With all the other costs, insurance, boat investment slip, matianence, etc. It always came down to alot of coin per pound of fish. everyone has a budget, whether it be a 65 Bert( Nice JBK) for a 20 ft center console. you buy what you can afford to own, and nowadays, what you can afford to run. You do not have to hit the canyons every week, it is a big ocean with alot of places to fish and there is also the bays. If you have to really start to think about it and sweat it, add it up, break it out by cost of fish etc. then it has lost it's purpose. i have always tried to own the best boat that i could, and used it accordingly. Some were canyon capable, some were not. As JBK says, you want to hear the screaming reel. It does not have to be a 400 lb Marlin. Stay within your means and relax and have fun. Life is to short. We are all frustrated as to what is recently happening with the economy and fuel, etc. It will all work out.
 

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Warden Pass said:
Think about it with a hypothetical income of $1 miliion per year after taxes with a very good account and depreciation scedules/ your still paying in the 30% tax bracket. net $700,000.00
That's only the federal income tax. Now add in state income taxes and local taxes if you work in New York City, $30k in self employment tax if you are self employed and astronomical property taxes and you are at more like $525,000 or $550,000 net income.
 

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GetReel said:
That's only the federal income tax. Now add in state income taxes and local taxes if you work in New York City, $30k in self employment tax if you are self employed and astronomical property taxes and you are at more like $525,000 or $550,000 net income.
I would be glad to pay that.....:D
 

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JBK4001 said:
I would be glad to pay that.....:D
It's a shame. You work 100 hours a week for 20 years (in the process creating jobs for several other poeple) and then when you finally succeed, you have various governments confiscaing almost half your income and the politicans on TV claiming that you still are not doing your "fair share.":confused: :confused:
 

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Dr. Bass said:
Agee 100 percent

I can tell you this ALL charters down here in Florida are really hurting.

To me the big CC's with 4 stroke gas engines make more sense now more than ever.
Less money on maintenance, no cost while at the dock( AC), and yes gas is CHEAPER than diesel now, maybe for good,
I pay 3.25-3.50 for 89 octane right now, we burn about 35-40 gallons per hour, yesterday I ran a total of 240 miles and burned about 225 gallons

Total cost for the trip 880, was 780 for gas 100 for bait and ice. 220 dollars per man. We usually do take home at least 20 pounds of fish each which easily covers the contribution

Total cost for my trip
YOUR TRIP EXPENSE CAME OUT GREAT. YOU ARE RIGHT ABOUT THE AVERAGE JOE DOING CHARTERS THIS YEAR. THE PRICE IS UP AND THE HOME LIFE EXPENSES HAVE GONE WILD. SOME GUYS WHO WENT OFFSHORE A LOT WILL BE CUT BUY 50 TO 75%. GOT SOME READING MATERIAL FOR YOUR LIBRARY. I'LL SEND IT OUT LATER THIS WEEK.

JBK4001--WELL SAID.
 

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BIGGESTJACK said:
YOUR TRIP EXPENSE CAME OUT GREAT. YOU ARE RIGHT ABOUT THE AVERAGE JOE DOING CHARTERS THIS YEAR. THE PRICE IS UP AND THE HOME LIFE EXPENSES HAVE GONE WILD. SOME GUYS WHO WENT OFFSHORE A LOT WILL BE CUT BUY 50 TO 75%. GOT SOME READING MATERIAL FOR YOUR LIBRARY. I'LL SEND IT OUT LATER THIS WEEK.

JBK4001--WELL SAID.
Please send more reading material, loved the last one !!

Funny how I did not even realize the charter buisness was hurting, failed to put two and two together, but I woke up real quick when a Captain and friend of a local bait store lamented on how tough it had become, the look in his eyes and on his face told it all. Real sad

I am sure fuel prices will affect all who fish eventually, those with money usually never squandered it in the first place
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
thnaks for the replys. I can't seem to pull the trigger. Maybe my Time is over or I just havn't found the right boat at the right price, One thing I know for sure 50' boats are over for me. I just cannot feel comfortable spending the money on them. Plus I never take my kids out (5 &10)as its too much work on the big boat. Maybe I got cheap (smart) as I aged. I never in my past thought twice about buying anything when it came to fishing. I just got off the Ocean 37 (billfish)factory boat 1 hour ago????

Believe me being boatless sucks. But buying the wrong boat could suck even worse. I think i will take a few more shots at custom express boats .

I just want to see billfish coming on the baits and wish it cost less. Based on the feedback I am not alone.

Hold and wait for better pricing or pull the trigger now and save the season? That is the question.

Captn Val
Warden Pass
 

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I know Im out of your league and probably shouldnt even be posting in this thread. But being so far away from the way you guys live I see something realy peculiar. Somehwere along the line you guys have become so hooked on big game that you may have lost touch with the kid inside. That kid who could have just as much fun catching a short flounder and find it just as exciting as the billfish you cant live without. Catching fish and being in a boat , any boat is what its all about. Doesnt matter how big the fish is or how far out it is.
 

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barrell said:
I know Im out of your league and probably shouldnt even be posting in this thread. But being so far away from the way you guys live I see something realy peculiar. Somehwere along the line you guys have become so hooked on big game that you may have lost touch with the kid inside. That kid who could have just as much fun catching a short flounder and find it just as exciting as the billfish you cant live without. Catching fish and being in a boat , any boat is what its all about. Doesnt matter how big the fish is or how far out it is.
True. But once you've caught a 1000 pound marlin, its hard to get excited about a bluefish.
 

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GetReel said:
True. But once you've caught a 1000 pound marlin, its hard to get excited about a bluefish.

You would get excited about the tiny fuel bill for the bluefish though :):)
 
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