BASS BARN banner

1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,374 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
What a seriously screwed-up system.

Tepper's Move May Affect New Jersey Budget, Forecaster Warns

The decision by billionaire hedge-fund manager David Tepper to quit New Jersey for tax-friendly Florida could complicate estimates of how much tax money the struggling state will collect, the head of the Legislature’s nonpartisan research branch warned lawmakers.

Tepper, 58, registered to vote in Florida in October, listing a Miami Beach condominium as his permanent address, and in December filed a court document declaring that he is now a resident of the state. On Jan. 1, he relocated his Appaloosa Management from New Jersey to Florida, which is free of personal-income and estate taxes.

His move has state revenue officials on alert.

“We may be facing an unusual degree of income-tax forecast risk,” Frank Haines, budget and finance officer with the Office of Legislative Services told a Senate committee Tuesday in Trenton.

New Jersey relies on personal income taxes for about 40 percent of its revenue, and less than 1 percent of taxpayers contribute about a third of those collections, according to the legislative services office. A one percent forecasting error in the income-tax estimate can mean a $140 million gap, Haines said.

Tepper lived in New Jersey for more than two decades, initially as an executive at Goldman Sachs Group Inc., where he helped run junk-bond trading during the late 1980s and early 1990s. He founded Appaloosa in 1993 and now has an estimated fortune of $10.6 billion, according to the Bloomberg Billionaires Index. That ranked him as the wealthiest person in New Jersey.

New Jersey residents bear the country’s third-highest tax burden, according to the Tax Foundation in Washington. Along with the nation’s highest property taxes, it’s one of two states that levy both an estate tax on the deceased and an inheritance tax on their heirs. The income-tax rate for top earners is 8.97 percent. Democratic legislators have repeatedly passed a millionaire’s tax that would increase the levy to 10.75 percent, but Republican Governor Chris Christie has vetoed it each time.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other...new-jersey-budget-forecaster-warns/ar-BBrovHB
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,662 Posts
Has not the big guy been warning us this was coming? The rich are going to bail and leave everyone else holding the bag. Go ahead tax us some more. No one will live here.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,318 Posts
The pure unadulterated greed of the masses will eventually kill the goose that laid the golden egg. It is human nature and inevitable. Tepper is just one notable example. But lots of people have fled high tax jurisdictions. For example, Derek Jeter was smart enough to never stay in his NY apartment long enough to be declared a NY State resident and instead declares his residence as Tampa. Lots of other sports figures were equally smart. The tax burden in NYC is so concentrated that, although the city has over 8 million people, a mere 10,000 people account for the vast, vast majority of tax receipts and former Mayor Bloomberg famously declared that that if the wrong 5000 people moved the entire city government would collapse, which lead NY State officials to look at their tax receipts and similarly conclude that the government of New York State too would collapse if the wrong 5000 NYC residents left. With technology making it irrelevant where one works, the only thing keeping people in high tax places is children attending elite schools and the social scene. But that is only good for so much and eventually people will conclude that they don't want to be looted. On the federal side, you can't avoid federal taxes by leaving if you are a citizen, but our offensive level of taxation is keeping lots of rich foreigners from wanting to live here. Eventually the greed that causes the masses to shift the tax burden to fewer and fewer people will cause the entire house of cards of collapse. Of course, the masses will blame it on something other than themselves.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,374 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
The pure unadulterated greed of the masses will eventually kill the goose that laid the golden egg. It is human nature and inevitable. Tepper is just one notable example. But lots of people have fled high tax jurisdictions. For example, Derek Jeter was smart enough to never stay in his NY apartment long enough to be declared a NY State resident and instead declares his residence as Tampa. Lots of other sports figures were equally smart. The tax burden in NYC is so concentrated that, although the city has over 8 million people, a mere 10,000 people account for the vast, vast majority of tax receipts and former Mayor Bloomberg famously declared that that if the wrong 5000 people moved the entire city government would collapse, which lead NY State officials to look at their tax receipts and similarly conclude that the government of New York State too would collapse if the wrong 5000 NYC residents left. With technology making it irrelevant where one works, the only thing keeping people in high tax places is children attending elite schools and the social scene. But that is only good for so much and eventually people will conclude that they don't want to be looted. On the federal side, you can't avoid federal taxes by leaving if you are a citizen, but our offensive level of taxation is keeping lots of rich foreigners from wanting to live here. Eventually the greed that causes the masses to shift the tax burden to fewer and fewer people will cause the entire house of cards of collapse. Of course, the masses will blame it on something other than themselves.
The masses don't write the tax laws, and they don't write the policy. The politicians bribe the people with other people's money to get their votes, and the people foolishly fall for it. The leadership knows a majority of the people will, because they spend the resources on advertising, focus groups and polling word-smithed questions to get the results they want.

Quality leadership carries responsibilities with it, and our leadership chooses its own greed instead almost every time.

“At the root of America’s economic crisis lies a moral crisis: the decline of civic virtue among America’s political and economic elite. A society of markets, laws, and elections is not enough if the rich and powerful fail to behave with respect, honesty, and compassion toward the rest of society and toward the world.”
-- Jeffrey Sachs
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,318 Posts
The masses don't write the tax laws, and they don't write the policy. The politicians bribe the people with other people's money to get their votes, and the people foolishly fall for it. The leadership knows a majority of the people will, because they spend the resources on advertising, focus groups and polling word-smithed questions to get the results they want.

Quality leadership carries responsibilities with it, and our leadership chooses its own greed instead almost every time.

“At the root of America’s economic crisis lies a moral crisis: the decline of civic virtue among America’s political and economic elite. A society of markets, laws, and elections is not enough if the rich and powerful fail to behave with respect, honesty, and compassion toward the rest of society and toward the world.”
-- Jeffrey Sachs
The masses vote for politicians who promise to give them lots of things and soak the "rich" with the bill. The idea that the "rich" control things and use their power to soak themselves with offensively high taxes is delusional.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,374 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
The masses vote for politicians who promise to give them lots of things and soak the "rich" with the bill. The idea that the "rich" control things and use their power to soak themselves with offensively high taxes is delusional.
Oh so the politicians are working for the people, now that's delusional or an outright lie. Given the money spent on advertising, focus groups and outcome directed polling, a lie is more likely. Politicians want enough votes to get elected, and they want to line their own pockets. They need money to do it. The majority of that money comes from those rich enough to afford to pay the bribe, or "campaign contribution" as it's called in this corrupt system. The offensive taxes get paid by those not rich enough to own some politicians or find adequate tax avoidance routes. Some consider those taxes as the price they have to pay to keep the masses away.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
639 Posts
Don't think this will be the last, may not be the worst idea to diversify your exposure to NJ muni bonds....stick with essential issue bonds. State is in rough shape and getting worse.....Atlantic City, Camden, Bergen County(companies moving NY for tax benefits).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,374 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
It's gotten so bad that current, as well as former, presidential candidates are using non-profit organizations for accepting "donations" from the rich, and foreign governments; including those that funded 911.

Yet it's the greedy masses that caused the debt and the disgusting level of taxation :please: Looks like the masses are even better at leading from behind than obama.

McCain-Linked Nonprofit Received $1 Million From Saudi Arabia

A nonprofit with ties to Senator John McCain received a $1 million donation from the government of Saudi Arabia in 2014, according to documents filed with the U.S. Internal Revenue Service.

The Arizona Republican has strictly honorary roles with the McCain Institute for International Leadership, a program at Arizona State University, and its fundraising arm, the McCain Institute Foundation, according to his office. But McCain has appeared at fundraising events for the institute and his Senate campaign’s fundraiser is listed in its tax returns as the contact person for the foundation.

Though federal law strictly bans foreign contributions to electoral campaigns, the restriction doesn’t apply to nonprofits engaged in policy, even those connected to a sitting lawmaker.

Groups critical of the current ethics laws say that McCain’s nonprofit effectively gives Saudi Arabia -- or any other well-heeled interests -- a means of making large donations to politicians it hopes to influence.

“Foreign governments are prohibited from financing candidate campaigns and political parties,” Craig Holman, the government affairs lobbyist for ethics watchdog Public Citizen, said. “Funding the lawmakers’ nonprofit organizations is the next best thing.”

Clinton Foundation


Holman said that the Clinton Foundation, whose top donors include Australia, Norway, Saudi Arabia and Sweden, may have started the trend of foreign governments donating to nonprofits connected to political figures.

http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/a...onprofit-received-1-million-from-saudi-arabia
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,318 Posts
Oh so the politicians are working for the people, now that's delusional or an outright lie. Given the money spent on advertising, focus groups and outcome directed polling, a lie is more likely. Politicians want enough votes to get elected, and they want to line their own pockets. They need money to do it. The majority of that money comes from those rich enough to afford to pay the bribe, or "campaign contribution" as it's called in this corrupt system. The offensive taxes get paid by those not rich enough to own some politicians or find adequate tax avoidance routes. Some consider those taxes as the price they have to pay to keep the masses away.

Your statements are facially absurd. Take Tepper himself. Your premise is that as the richest person in NJ he was a rich power broker controlling the government and he used his power to subject himself to offensive levels of taxation -- to the tune of several hundred million a year in state taxes -- that drove him out of the state. To articulate your premise is to demonstrate its absurdity. I get that lots of people are envious of the financially successful and lot of people are disaffected, but lets not be absurd.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,374 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Your statements are facially absurd. Take Tepper himself. Your premise is that as the richest person in NJ he was a rich power broker controlling the government and he used his power to subject himself to offensive levels of taxation -- to the tune of several hundred million a year in state taxes -- that drove him out of the state. To articulate your premise is to demonstrate its absurdity. I get that lots of people are envious of the financially successful and lot of people are disaffected, but lets not be absurd.
"Facially absurd" is an excellent example of the sort of word-smithing used routinely by the establishment-government-media-complex to misdirect, obfuscate, mislead and manipulate the American People, or as you call them "the masses". At a glance someone not paying much attention would read that at think, yep otfm's statement about the rich raising taxes on themselves does seem absurd. Why would anyone do that; the guy must be nuts. However, if one gives it a think, it's a different story. Facially simply limits the discussion to the surface only, and it's a much deeper and more complex topic than that, but for an establishment supporter, the topic needs to remain on the surface; otherwise the ugliness of the establishment becomes known.

If the level is to be facially, then that means all the rich democrats went into politics to raise taxes on themselves. Don't think many will buy that if that's what you're selling.

Tepper is a democrat, and he contributes to both sides of the aisle. Consider our last governor, Corzine another insider who promoted tax increases. How about Buffett or Soros, more democrats. Are these super rich paying politicians or going into politics to raise their own taxes, or is that simply viewed by them as the cost of acquiring power and doing business?

The majority of people aren't walking around envious of the financially successful. However, during election season there are many scumbags who use the ugly emotion of envy as a tool to create division and to try to manipulate the people into voting for them. What's absurd on all levels is when one sees the Clinton's, or similar wealthy democrats playing the envy card.

Disaffected, yes lots, and growing because more people can see what the Washington establishment has been doing to their country while they've been living their lives.

The glasses are on, and the American People are starting to see the truth.




Tepper is doing exactly what many democrats do in NJ. They make their money here. Support liberal idiocy that raises taxes, and then they run away leaving the rest of us, who never vote for their nonsense, holding the bag.

FWIW, the term "the masses" is somewhat insulting to many people. It sort of reveals an elitist attitude, but it is becoming clear that the establishment views the American people that way. It's a shame, and dishonest in many respects. It seems as if the establishment dislikes the American People, until they need them for something like sending their children off to fight their wars. Then they heap on praise and tell them how great they are.

There used to be another guy here who used that offensive term. He claimed he was running away to Thailand because he was afraid of the "greedy masses". Nobody here is sure if he really went, and I suspect many thought it was BS. Though there are rumors he came back to the board with a new name.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,566 Posts
There used to be another guy here who used that offensive term. He claimed he was running away to Thailand because he was afraid of the "greedy masses". Nobody here is sure if he really went, and I suspect many thought it was BS. Though there are rumors he came back to the board with a new name.
The first guy claimed Thailand was a paradise. Funny that right after the little coup that occurred in that ''paradise'' (third world country) the new name showed up.
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top