BASS BARN banner
1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
88 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
If your toggin or seabassing you fish streight down, is there a big deal if another vessel drops anchor next to your vessel and fishes?

I'm not talking about chumming for Palegic fish.

Do you first ask for permission? Is there a crowding or unsafe zone?

If the wreck is 300ft long how many boats can fish on it- one? 4?

What if I put 2 anchors out at 45deg with 600ft line do I own the wreck?

Happy New Year
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,862 Posts
There is no written rule how close or how many can fit on a wreck. When we are out wreckin we do not drop on a wreck that is already being fished. We move on to another one, there are plenty of the out there.

Good luck knocking on the bottom :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,180 Posts
Man that would suck !
alot of wrecks have scattered pieces,and a few are not far out from C.M,If someone is on the main struckture of the wreck but its not very big try another piece of it ! You may be pleasently suprised ........
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,030 Posts
That would all depend on if Chumstain is out there. If Chum has the bigger boat he is in. All seriousness aside. If you think of asking the question: Should I ask permission? You need to move on. That is a huge ocean, with alot of wrecks. Don't be a stooge. HAPPY DAYS.


Ding
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,180 Posts
Ding My Man ;) :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
88 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
looking at answers and all are good- thank you
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
815 Posts
Yesterday we were on a small to mid size wreck when a party boat pulled right up. I would say no more than 30-40 feet away. I thought the anchor line was a goner. They had a full boat and a nice crew, but my heart sank when 30 baits landed in the water! I warned the mates, jokingly of course, that we caught them all. After about 25 minutes we only saw 3-4 landed. Two thoughts to this. First, it was late in the day and we were getting ready to leave anyway, and second I guess it's paybacks for a rec guy. I'm sure after awhile the party captains get annoyed when recs follow them about and fish right next to them(Probably those summer weekenders!). So, in the end it was nice to have company and we had fish in the box anyway. This event was nothing compared to almost getting run over by the vessel FINWOOD, I think it is the name, while we were anchored over the wreck. We watched as a 300-400 foot cargo came dead for us for miles-and I mean dead on. He did not respond to channel 16. When it was apparent he was not changing course, we had no choice but to get off anchor and back off. We were amazed as he ran right over the wreck and about 10 feet from our wreck marker ball. Do you think he monitors radar or his chartplotter? I chalk both incidents up to it being the last trip of the year, where we caught fish and practically the only boats we saw that day, could have been seen by a blind man. My brother has pictures and video. Good memories on the last trip of the season.

[ 12-31-2004, 10:09 AM: Message edited by: Tip of the day ]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
426 Posts
Tug in tow has right of way,[restricted maneuverability]. WW REEF is right in Tug lane, got to pay attention. Just my opinion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
815 Posts
Originally posted by capt.alc111:
Tug in tow has right of way,[restricted maneuverability]. WW REEF is right in Tug lane, got to pay attention. Just my opinion.
I agree, but this was no tug and we were 16 miles east of the WW REEF. Without making the rules an issue, common sense tells me a slight correction in course was due. I was the restricted vessel on anchor, and it's a big ocean, this was no river channel. The lesson here is a good look-out and take any action neccesary to avoid collision. We did that as I hope anyone else would do. It is simply not fun. If this were at night and nobody at watch, I would not be typing this right now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,570 Posts
captalc.111 and anyone else -

while its never a good idea to play games with the big guys....

just to keep the record straigt for guys who need to know the rules of the road (all of us)...a tug and tow only is RAM (restricted in the ability to manuever) if so declared by flying ball over diamond over ball dayshape or red/white/red ligts in the rigging at night. A tug and tow not declared RAM and not in a narrow channel is just another power vessel.

AND nobody has higher precedence over an anchored vessel in open water not in a narrow channel or approach traffic lane (where you're not supposed to anchor anyway).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,030 Posts
Familiarity breeds ignorance and arrogance. Just ask Chumstain. As in any other vocation, professionalism can go to ones head. Once someone convinces themselves they are better at something, than others, they start making misguided calls. The other side of the coin, one mans hamburger, is another mans steak. To you(small boat) seeing the larger boat approach your position, as opposed to the larger boat pulling into a position well away from a small boat. Just being in the smaller boat can create an intimidated attitude.

If your anchored up and you get hit, your just as much at fault as the vehicle that hits you. The rules on the water is a bit different than the rules of the road. If your hit, and you happen to survive, you don't have a real convincing story, that you tried your best to avoid the collision. Most times the smaller vessel pulling anchor is much easier and maneuverable than a very large vessel making an adjustment.

The best set of circumstances here would be: Both skippers are intelligent and sober, consciencious, alert, not given to foolishness, courteous.

Next: One skipper being ignorant, and one being courteous.


Worst: Both skippers being ignorant.


Everyone involved can make the difference. Being a destroyer and a killer, is no better than being destroyed or killed.

Use your head. If you have a problem with decision making, boating is not the best form of recreation for you. Try basket weaving. There aren't too many life threatening incedents, while weaving baskets. HAPPY DAYS.


Ding

[ 01-01-2005, 09:36 AM: Message edited by: Ding ]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,570 Posts
Ding...I'm not sure how much of your post is directed at me...

For those that want to know the rules as written (not necessarily practiced) or might be wannabe licensed captains...my post is accurate...

I disagree that if you are anchored and get run over you would be found at fault...of course you are correct in that...YOU MAY NEVER BE FOUND TO ARGUE YOUR CASE!!!!LOL!!!!

But I did start off by stating ...fooling around the big boys is never a good idea. There are a lot more yahoos drifting in the DELBAY shipping channel that are flirting danger than guys anchoring on wrecks offshore out of any approach traffic lane.

A tug and tow or any commercial guy who nearly runs over someone at anchor just isn't doing his/her job all that well....especially with ARPA radars nowadays. But on the other side if the coin...if I did a lot of anchoring near coastal traffic route (not lanes)...I would be flying a HUGE anchor ball even if I was in my kayak.

Wait till I get run over?????...I doubt I would let that happen either. Like any prudent mariner....in a small boat (less that 65') I would make sure I have a quick method of getting underway and marking my anchor line.

I'm not trying to promote arrogance...just teaching the rules/facts and will be glad to further anyone's general seamanship skills if they care to learn.

Happy New Year!!! Be safe out there........
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
52,618 Posts
capt scott---should capt.cris have reported the finnwood to the coast guard or is that like peeing into the wind??

[ 01-01-2005, 11:18 AM: Message edited by: BIGGESTJACK ]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,570 Posts
Biggestjack - he could have but at that point the CG would have asked "what do you want to do?" If you wanted to go through the hassle of filling out all the paperwork and submitting evidence then that's a decision that you have to make right at the moment. As long as no one was hurt and not TOO SCARED...then....yeah...probably pissin in the wind but at least the Finwood would be on record if an incident did occur at some later date.

Yhe trick is....if you have someone bearing down on you and you are at anchor....

1. Start broadcasting on ch16 as soon as possible with your posit, you vessel name and name of vessel and or description of vessel bearing down on you. State you are at anchor. Try a couple times...then alternate between 16/13 with the calls. That gives a slight break in clogging ch16 too.

2. After several radio attempts, call the USCG and see if they can raise the ship/and or at least advise them of your situation. Get a radio check if nothing heard from vessel or USCG.


3. At no time get so bogged down in radio transmissions that you can't slip anchor and get out of the way (plenty an oceangoer has steamed into port with a sailboat mast sticking out of it's hawse pipe.)

4. Take photos/video if possible. Write exact times and positions down, plus times radio transmissions were made. Estimate ships first position you belived a collision existed and estimate the ships speed and direction of travel. Note any course changes during the passing.

5. Fly an anchor ball dayshape whenever anchored.

other than that....good luck one way or the other...you shouldn't have to move but like Ding said...playing chicken is a dumb way to end your life.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
815 Posts
Originally posted by Capt. Scott:
The trick is....if you have someone bearing down on you and you are at anchor....

1. Start broadcasting on ch16 as soon as possible with your posit, you vessel name and name of vessel and or description of vessel bearing down on you. State you are at anchor. Try a couple times...then alternate between 16/13 with the calls. That gives a slight break in clogging ch16 too.
We did call to no avail. We did not call on 13, and I like that idea for the future.

2. After several radio attempts, call the USCG and see if they can raise the ship/and or at least advise them of your situation. Get a radio check if nothing heard from vessel or USCG.
[/QUOTE]

Got a radio check earlier, radio working fine. Did not call the CG because it was clear blue sky, 10 knot wind, sunny and great visibility. Saw him coming for miles visually and on radar. I hope he was in the same position given his responsibility of such a large vessel under command.

3. At no time get so bogged down in radio transmissions that you can't slip anchor and get out of the way (plenty an oceangoer has steamed into port with a sailboat mast sticking out of it's hawse pipe.)
[/QUOTE]

Ask anyone, I also fly and am anal about safety. We were ready to move when he was 4-5 miles out. At first I thought it might have been a CG patrol boat. Most anyone in our position that day would have believed he might have turned 10-15 degrees 2-3 miles out. Did not happen, we moved, no big deal. I find it more interesting with such a large draft he ran directly over the wreck.
4. Take photos/video if possible. Write exact times and positions down, plus times radio transmissions were made. Estimate ships first position you belived a collision existed and estimate the ships speed and direction of travel. Note any course changes during the passing.
[/QUOTE]

we have both video and pictures. I believed a risk of collision existed when we first saw him 5-6 miles out and through binoculars and radar could tell he was dead on and never changed course. Speed was approx 10-14 knots.

5. Fly an anchor ball dayshape whenever anchored.
other than that....good luck one way or the other...you shouldn't have to move but like Ding said...playing chicken is a dumb way to end your life.
[/QUOTE]

Ok, guilty of no anchor ball. Getting one for next year. Do they sell them at the AC boat show? For whats its worth, the party boat that later pulled up next to us did not have one either.

I did not mean to make a big deal of it all, i only brought it to surface as a comparison to someone anchoring next to you, which on this day, was no big deal compared to the tanker incident. What pissed me most was we finally had the perfect anchor right over the wreck, then tanker showed 10 minutes later, and had trouble redoing it later!! I need a winch! and BTW Mr. Ding I have no problems making the right decisions, whether based on common sense and/or the rules, in a prudent timely fashion. I don't believe we met before, you will just have to ask my peers and anyone who has been with me whether it has been on the road, the water, or in the air. I bring these situations to the board to flush them out and to bring safety home. I don't teach it, and don't pretend to know it all, lest no ignorance, by your logic, but I leave that to the experts, like Capt Scott and others. I just think of all the boaters out there, and maybe it could have been someone else-that would not have moved. These discussions are good learning tools. Thanks Capt Scott for the rules and wisdom. Happy New Year to all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,570 Posts
Capt. Chris...I didn't mean to quiz you...it was for all/future reference...sounds like you did well anyway.....you just encountered a vessel not so on the ball (no pun intended about anchor balls).

For a good anchor ball all you need is a ball, ball fender, etc, painted black hoisted up or mounted on a pole. You can also cut two circles out of plywood with slots cut half way down. Slide the two together so it makes sort of a three dimensions ball...paint it black...mount the same. (email if confused I'll send a diagram)

No guarantees the big ships will look and see anyway.

Good luck in the future...hopefully that is your once in a lifetime close call.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,448 Posts
Without flying an anchor ball, it may have been too late for a large ship to alter course after seeing an anchor line. In my experience running charter and party boats, I have never had a large ship change course for me. Tugs on the other hand, seem more willing to follow the rules of the road.
As for the Capt. Robbins, it probably gets tough trying to find a spot, with this nice weather, that doesn't have a boat on it. As long as the spot is big enough and you are not in any danger, there should be no problem sharing. Plus, being a 12 knot boat and late in the day, the next spot for him to go to may be a 1/2-1 hour away.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
88 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Capt. Scott, thank you for your advice. It shows I'm USCG unlimited eng.-super mechanic- but I'll still take advice when capt. my own boat. Still feel bad for one of my friend, wreck-anchors in fog with little elec. Don't feel like any advice is warrented except don't do it!

As for other answers- '2 boats fish same wreck'- each has there points and i will consider all applicable to the situation.

This is a hobby for me and I've enought stress at work not trying to compound it.

Will always coninue reading cite till omitted.

Again thanks all- 'Maggie'
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,339 Posts
maggievee,

From your recount of the event you did what any capt. would do, protect your crew and boat.

I would file a complaint against the tanker with the USCG and move on.

You will not get anywhere but like what was said in previous post's it will be on file and maybe down the line it will come back and bite the captain in the a**.

DM2

[ 01-02-2005, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: NIGHTSTRIKES ]
 
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Top